Oh dear, the situation with the Arch Linux AUR got a fair bit worse since GamingOnLinux initially covered the malicious packages.
  • HaraldvonBlauzahn@feddit.org
    21·
    12 hours ago

    You are right that the distribution as it provides binary code is a trust root. If you can’t trust them, you have nothing to stand on.

    I had the impression that CachyOS suggests to use AUR packages - maybe I am wrong here?

    And if CachyOS is (what I am just assuming) geared towards less technical users, can you really expect their average user to examine shell scripts from a forum post?

    How do their users even know that the post and its author is legitimate? Are they supposed to check PGP keys?

    You can call that paranoid but there is a reason why distributions use packkage signing, publish webs of trust, and why the Guix developers even worked hard to reduce the binary bootstrapping code for the distro down to 512 bytes - it is a consequence of the “trusting trust” problem posed by Ken Thompson that the more stuff is opaque, the more trust is needed.

    • 5ymm3trY@discuss.tchncs.de
      2·
      9 hours ago

      I have no idea about the stance of CachyOS on AUR packages.

      I totally agree with you, establishing trust is not an easy problem. I don’t expect the average joe to understand shell scripts. I would put myself in that categorie as well. This one however was simple enough that it seemed okay to me. If I don’t understand what’s going on in a script I am really careful and try to avoid it, if possible. I still wouldn’t consider them universally bad. For some things it is even the recommended install option. I vaguely remember some things in the Raspberry Pi universe ( IIRC this was even the case for Docker in the past).

      There are multiple factors which can lead to trust. Maybe you know the CachyOS forum and how well it is maintained. How old is the account etc… But as you said, there are always risks. The account could be compromized as well. But most of that isn’t specific to shell scripts or Linux in general. You shouldn’t install an application from some shady website in Windows either.

      What is your recommended way to deal with the current situation?

      • HaraldvonBlauzahn@feddit.org
        1·
        1 hour ago
        What is your recommended way to deal with the current situation?
        • don’t tolerate malware. Get out the big hammer. This is an attack on Linux.
        • be frugal on what you install
        • slowing down. Not everything needs to be bleeding edge.
        • perhaps use automated cooldown times of 2/4/8/12 weeks for changed packages, depending on software trustworthiness, and users experience. More cooldown for owner change.
        • each PKGBUILD in an own repo, with a single owner
        • removing all AUR recommendations from the Arch wiki
        • gather the user community to help with review and testing of AUR packages, transforming the most important ones into extra packages
        • score all packages by trustworthiness
        • reward quality and sane practices when trusting / scoring packages - fire up a competition for quality
        • build a web of trust, possibly with actually user-friendly software instead of GnuPG
        • construct a robust voting/package reputation system for normal users (this is very hard because by experience, reputation systems can easily be gamed, it will by all experience NOT work purely electronically)
        • ultimately trust in people, not personas or algorithms